A forum for Glamorgan CCC fans
By Neverout
#32185
Yesterday's match demonstrated yet again some of the problems of the Glamorgan development system.

Managed by yet another of the " former friend s and colleagues " who infest the system, the Wales National County side were filled with current and former Glamorgan contracted players as well as former and current members of the MCCU development arm.

This confusion of how the W.N.C. team fits into the pathway system is demonstrative of the lack of planning and clarity of purpose which contributed to the failure of the County to properly develop players.

Glamorgan contracted players have the ones, twos and premier sides as a development / coaching pathway. Academy players have the Wales / South West England age group sides , twos and club cricket pathway.

The MCCU side mops up older academy players and external candidates who have the MCCU matches, BUCS matches, twos and club games .

This should leave the W.N.C side for talented amateurs, young club players who slipped through the net, late developers and talented incomers who have moved to the area.

Instead of clear and defined pathways to which normal performance criteria could be applied we have a hotch-potch of me and my mates being selected and assessed by another group of me and my mates. Rather than a development system we appear to be running a social club where teams are picked at random from within the same pool. No wonder it doesn't work.
By glamman
#32186
This should leave the W.N.C side for talented amateurs, young club players who slipped through the net, late developers and talented incomers who have moved to the area.

Firstly, I am not sure there are any "young club players who slipped through the net". My guess is that most of the categories you describe have been covered. I am sure Glamorgan and WNC would be only to pleased if there were anymore potential stars out there. I think they must be hiding pretty well.

I come back to the fact that if you learn your cricket on pitches like yesterday's, as most in South Wales are (or worse), then it is difficult to get to the top level.
By Neverout
#32188
This season, for instance, I have seen strong hundreds in the Sewcl by youngsters Jamie Mills (pentyrch), Scott O'Leary ( Sudbrook) and two by Jack Pritchard (Lisvane) none of which were by slogging. Sam Hope-Bell (Chepstow) and Will Davey (Newbridge) have also impressed in the swpl div. 2.

I know one or two of them have had the odd representative match, but it would appear that not playing for the correct club can severely inhibit your progress and visibility. A bit like the coaching roles at the club.

Regarding pitches: a significant modern problem is that most youngsters now undertake most of their development and technical coaching on flat plastic facilities using bowling machines. They can all therefore bat at the Oval or on my road, but struggle to wait for movement on slower greener pitches. To blame the pitches for their lack of ability to adapt is to miss the deficiencies in the teaching system.

If pitches were the cause we would be inundated with successful bowlers at home matches which as we knows hardly the case. We can see this deficiency even at test level as soon as the ball starts moving. My solution would be to learn on what you play on and be satisfied manipulating the moving ball by playing it later with less of a swing and backlift as they used to do in the days when pitches were often uncovered.
By glamman
#32189
The slow pitches like yesterday's are as bad for bowler's as for batsmen's development. If the ball does not come onto the bat it is very difficult to play good cricket shots and score any runs.

If players want to progress then they have to play for a Premier League club. None of those players you name are. I know some (maybe not these) will be collecting match fees playing for lower league sides. If you score lots of runs or take lots of wickets in the Premier league then I can guarantee you will come to notice. If they are good then I am sure Premier teams will welcome them. However they have to put themsleves out there rather than carry on in the comfort and perhaps financially beneficial realms of the lower leagues.
By Neverout
#32190
The point is that there are youngsters who slip through the net for a variety of reasons and that their pathway should be the W.N.C. The very fact that no-one is looking is the point I am making.

Premier clubs have enough difficulty accommodating their county and academy players as well as their privately contracted professionals and existing members without having to recruit elsewhere. The notion that you have to play for certain clubs to progress i s a barrier to maximising the talent available

None of the players I have mentioned is being paid as far as I am aware. In my experience it is far more likely the former county players who are being paid in the sewcl than the youngsters.
By glamman
#32191
Neverout wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 12:01 pm The point is that there are youngsters who slip through the net for a variety of reasons and that their pathway should be the W.N.C. The very fact that no-one is looking is the point I am making.

Premier clubs have enough difficulty accommodating their county and academy players as well as their privately contracted professionals and existing members without having to recruit elsewhere. The notion that you have to play for certain clubs to progress i s a barrier to maximising the talent available

None of the players I have mentioned is being paid as far as I am aware. In my experience it is far more likely the former county players who are being paid in the sewcl than the youngsters.
The problem is that if you need to be scoring runs or taking wickets at the highest level available. If they are good enough to be playing county cricket they will have no trouble getting into a Premier league 1st XI. The standard of many of the teams is not as high as it was and they will be crying out for anyone that can strengthen their side. If players don't have that basic desire to further their game then they aren't going to get very far. It isn't going to be served up to them on a plate. I know players who have had to move clubs to be able to continue their push to play for Glamorgan when their first choice club has been relegated from the Premier League. I also know of players dropping down into lower league clubs to get paid.
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By Vetchetarian
#32213
As previously intimated, it has now been confirmed that James Harris will be rejoining Glam
in 2022.
By glamman
#32214
Assume we ar aren't going to keep all the seamers we currently have. Those already contracted for next season are:
Neser, Hogan, Weighell, Carey, Douthwaite and now Harris

Those out of contract:
McIlroy, Smith, TvdG, Walker

That makes 10! However I guess the stretched resources at the moment may suggest you keep all of them.
By Neverout
#32215
The story is TVDG is assessing his options and will, I am sure , attract offers from other counties. Neser will probably only be here part-time , if at all. Sadly I think Smith will have to be released given his injury concerns and it is unlikely Weighell and Douthwaite will be troubling the bowling award committee.

We therefore should be looking for seamers , but I cannot see Harris as the solution given his lack-lustre displays earlier in the season. If that was a trial the answer should surely have been no. Still, it will be another uncritical friendly face in the changing room for the team management.

I would much rather we trawled through the younger cast offs of other counties for people we could offer improved coaching and opportunities to. Only half of that statement would be true.

This goes back to my point about the Director of Cricket looking at and talking to the fringe players from other counties on a Saturday rather than playing for a few extra pennies
Jehosaphat, exileKT8 liked this
By hujon64
#32216
I do hope TVDG re-signs as we desperately need him. However, Harris has been given a contract for just one season and will be available for all formats. He is an experienced bowler and can often add useful runs so a reasonable acquisition I think. Although not particularly interested in the 100, it has given many promising youngsters a chance to impress in the 50 over format, almost like trials. Carlson, is, of course Very impressive and a future WELSH Glamorgan captain with, perhaps, Lloyd taking over from Cooke next season who has received some criticism for his captaincy skills - not easy when w/k as well. Some more interesting decisions for management on contracts, Captaincy, etc.
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By Vetchetarian
#32217
hujon64 wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 3:44 pm I do hope TVDG re-signs as we desperately need him. However, Harris has been given a contract for just one season and will be available for all formats. He is an experienced bowler and can often add useful runs so a reasonable acquisition I think. Although not particularly interested in the 100, it has given many promising youngsters a chance to impress in the 50 over format, almost like trials. Carlson, is, of course Very impressive and a future WELSH Glamorgan captain with, perhaps, Lloyd taking over from Cooke next season who has received some criticism for his captaincy skills - not easy when w/k as well. Some more interesting decisions for management on contracts, Captaincy, etc.
Hardly woth Harris getting out of bed for a one yesr contract. He's still a young man, after all.
Perhaps this is just to get him on the first rung of the retirement home ladder, which may well become his permanent residence some time down the line.
That's the cynic in me talking, but there is a lot of previous at Cardiff CC. --- " Jobsfortheboys 'R' Us ".
I sincerely hope he has a mega 2022, boy do we need something like that to inspire us all.

Your Carlson and Lloyd captaincy observations have much merit. Both fine players.
By glamman
#32221
Neverout wrote: Fri Jul 23, 2021 1:59 pm The story is TVDG is assessing his options and will, I am sure , attract offers from other counties. Neser will probably only be here part-time , if at all. Sadly I think Smith will have to be released given his injury concerns and it is unlikely Weighell and Douthwaite will be troubling the bowling award committee.

We therefore should be looking for seamers , but I cannot see Harris as the solution given his lack-lustre displays earlier in the season. If that was a trial the answer should surely have been no. Still, it will be another uncritical friendly face in the changing room for the team management.

I would much rather we trawled through the younger cast offs of other counties for people we could offer improved coaching and opportunities to. Only half of that statement would be true.

This goes back to my point about the Director of Cricket looking at and talking to the fringe players from other counties on a Saturday rather than playing for a few extra pennies
Personally I think the best attack, if everyone fit, consists of Neser, TvdG, Walker and Smith. I know Smith's injury issues are a concern but if they think they can sort them out, they will want to keep him. TvdG seems to be the question mark and it will be interesting to see how he goes in the Hundred and whether he will get any offers or resign. He did not start today and I don't think the Trent team will be losing any of their bowlers during the competition. De Lange was certainly on fire today.
Walker will surely also be offered a new contract and that leaves McIlroy out of contract and who we just haven't seen much of. He appears to be fit again but did not play in the WNC game despite being in the squad and then did not feature in the squad for Thursday, instead playing in the 2nd team friendly. I assume he will get a run in the RL at soem point but might eventually be let go. All the other bowlers have a contract for next year so might see more shed after next season.
By glamman
#32240
The selections for the RL comp create lots of issues with regard to the squad. Gorvin selected ahead of Weighell and McIlroy? Weighell has a contract but McIlroy’s is up.
By Shamu
#32241
Young, uncapped players do not make much of a dent in the playing budget. It’s overseas and experienced imports that are governed by market values.
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